[Drama chat] Ingredients for the perfect rom-com
by missvictrix
What makes the perfect rom-com? This is definitely a topic where everyone will have their own opinions and take on the matter, because even though tropes are an ingrained part of the genre, we all have our favorites (or least favorites), and we all have the sort of storytelling and story dynamics we prefer.
For instance, I don’t enjoy a loveline that starts with a one-night stand — instead, I am all about the meet-cute or the bickering beginning, and then the slow path of catching feelings. To me, it’s the process and cadence of the OTP falling in love that makes all the fun. Similarly, there are plot devices and tropes that I love (hero to the rescue, BandAiding scenes, near-kisses) and ones that make me groan (returning exes, lingering misunderstandings). So maybe the ingredients for the “perfect” rom-com aren’t something that’s standard, but rather something that’s subjective?
What are the ingredients for a perfect rom-com for you? Which dramas showcase it?
Let the chatting begin!
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1 Linarrick
May 28, 2023 at 5:29 AM
I can name things I don’t like in a rom com:
Public proposals, I don’t care if they are satirising it, it’s still so cringe I can’t
The second half of a Hong Sisters drama. So basically angst that goes on forever and you’ll want to tear your hair out
Serial Killers.
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lapislazulii
May 28, 2023 at 6:31 PM
Totally agree with all three but especially about public proposals!! I don't think I've ever not fast forwarded through one hahaha and same goes with public serenades and super public confessions!
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OldLawyer
May 28, 2023 at 10:29 PM
It's the serial killers (or corporate politics) that I hate.
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welh
May 29, 2023 at 4:22 AM
The worst type of rom-com is the chaebol heir harassing, stalking, manipulating, threatening and pushing himself on a young, hard working woman of limited means who suddenly falls for his "charms" when he does not change at all. Even if the early rejections are humorous or the heir is a buffoon, it is just a sickening story line.
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2 anniemo
May 28, 2023 at 5:47 AM
For me, my love for a drama lives and dies with the OTP. No great drama doesn't have at its core characters that I can become deeply invested in. Sure, yeah, they can't get bogged down by a craptastic plot, but above all else I'm in it for the charasmatic heroes, the badass heroines who beguile them, and charged chemistry between the two that could power a city (or have me grinning like a fool, either is good!)
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3 Lonestar Girl
May 28, 2023 at 6:01 AM
It’s hard to put my finger on what I like, because, just like with people, it’s surprising what can make your heart flutter. But, things I don’t like are drawn out misunderstandings, noble idiocy, and parents who disapprove to the point of being irrational. And there’s absolutely no place for a serial killer storyline in my ideal romcom. Whoever thought that was a good idea?!
Now, I like a spunky but not rude heroine, a handsome tsundere hero, and a little bit of bickering and obstacles to overcome (gotta have some tension) balanced with tender and romantic moments. Move my heart! For example, there’s a scene in BOSSOM STEAL THE FATE that’s one of my all-time favorite romantic moments. It’s the one where the Princess went to visit Ba-woo when he was in jail. The pain of their separation! The look in their eyes! The soaring music! And when they held hands!! Perfection. 💖 Of course, good acting always helps.
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Lonestar Girl
May 28, 2023 at 6:07 AM
I should have stated I know BOSSOM is not a romcom; I was just using the scene as an example of what I like. I also forgot to add that a romcom should be lighthearted and make me laugh. Isn’t that the point?
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Cosmas
June 4, 2023 at 11:42 AM
Bossam is vividly a romantic drama to me. Although, there was no kiss scenes, only affection through the eyes, skinship and thoughts
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anniemo
May 28, 2023 at 6:18 AM
Emphatic yes on everything.... except Bossam. I'm sorry, Jung Il Woo fans, I keep trying to like him!
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HopefulRomantic 🦋 Tigermoth 🦞
May 28, 2023 at 7:07 AM
AHHH!!! That's my favorite scene in BOSSAM!! And it also ranks as one of my top favorite romantic drama moments of all-time :)
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4 Isa is always time travelling
May 28, 2023 at 6:17 AM
It's easier to say what I don't like, and I'm sure most beanies will agree: noble idiocy and time jumps.
That's why I'm amazed that I have enjoyed Fated to love you so much, because it has tons of noble idiocy and the time jump I'm always afraid of.
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Seon-ha
May 28, 2023 at 8:12 AM
I’m definitely with you on noble idiocy (unless it’s small and silly and moves the plot along quickly), but I stand happily ready to see a well-done time jump. I think it’s in part because each timea drama ends, I spend time wondering what happens next…and with a time jump sometimes I get a better feeling for what that might be?
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Isa is always time travelling
May 28, 2023 at 11:06 AM
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Isa is always time travelling
May 28, 2023 at 11:57 AM
I mean time jumps in the middle of the drama, which many times are directly related to a noble idiocy act. I would prefer a "mini" time jump (months? A year at the most?). But two or three years is too much for me XD
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Babylilo
May 29, 2023 at 9:15 AM
I think it IS possible to use a time jump effectively, but those instances are pretty rare. The worst-case scenario for me involves a time jump combined with noble idiocy—especially when the departed (usually the guy, I think) returns after a long, unexplained absence and the partner, who has been waiting/pining all that time, welcomes them back with little or no reproach. That’s ruined several dramas for me, including the infamous DO DO SOL SOL LA LA SOL and DOCTOR JOHN.
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Isa is always time travelling
May 29, 2023 at 11:41 PM
I couldn't believe my eyes when there was a three years time jump because of noble idiocy in a drama I was enjoying a lot (I won't say the name because it would be a spoiler). Three years without any kind of communication between the FM and the ML.
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Babylilo
May 30, 2023 at 4:58 AM
If it’s the drama I think you’re referring to, I agree it was a frustrating plot development. I was more willing to forgive it, though because a) the couple was so endearing and b) I can forgive the ML pretty much ANYTHING… 😊
Isa is always time travelling
May 30, 2023 at 7:08 AM
@babylilo As a clue, that drama that frustrated me so much with the three years time jump is from 2020.
Babylilo
May 30, 2023 at 8:12 AM
The drama I referenced is from 2015.
zk
May 30, 2023 at 6:13 PM
jang hyuk!!!! he was so funny and the show really used his physicality to the utmost to comedic effect.
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5 welh
May 28, 2023 at 6:43 AM
Recipe for a perfect rom-com:
two strong, independent characters
one realistic opportunity/encounter
one dash of attraction mixed with a dash of cynicism
let simmer over a low flame
for sauce: a pinch of cuteness, a dose of saltiness, a dab of sweetness, and a lot of hot emotions
mix together with serious conversation, adventurous awkwardness, humor, the slow dissolving of character’s social barriers and surprise observations about each other
garnish with hugs and kisses
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cozybooks
May 30, 2023 at 10:37 PM
Lol I think you've said it so perfectly all the beanies are just like "nuff said. I'll like it and they'll know that's the secret sauce, right there." Well done :)
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6 Reply1988 -❣️Mother Bean❣️ Underpants buddies for life. 😎
May 28, 2023 at 6:48 AM
I like strong and competent adults in their own right they may have had issues but these do not prevent them from coping with the day to day challenges of adult life, like the main leads in Shooting stars, Business proposal, Love all play. I like that the man falls for the woman first and that he wants to make sure that he is in a position to be a long term partner. I like a good friend network around them both so they have reliable people to bounce ideas off. When issues come up the couple talk like in Healer and they work out a solution.
If there is a separation it’s to grow as an individual and it’s not the end of the relationship. They have access to modern technology so they can maintain regular contact and visit each other and have a positive long distance relationship like in Our Beloved Summer.
I want the comedy to be laugh out loud funny and the sad times to be limited. Shooting stars and Business Proposal, Be Melodramatic and Jealousy incarnate were really funny at times. I want other romances in the background but not to overshadow the main leads; yes, we are talking about you Love is for suckers.
I don't want second leads that are clearly the better option so the lead is settling for second best and therefore is making a bad choice sticking with the unsuitable person. No evil female second leads playing games to manipulate the situation or clinging demanding male second leads who were great as friends but now because they waited too long to confess feel they have the right to demand first dibs when the woman has clearly friend zoned them.
I want solid storytelling throughout with beautiful scenery, nothing wasted stories so if it’s 8-12 episodes so be it. Friends to lovers, enemies to lovers, slice of life, office based all good to work alongside the rom com features.
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HopefulRomantic 🦋 Tigermoth 🦞
May 28, 2023 at 7:08 AM
I love all your explanations!!
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Seon-ha
May 28, 2023 at 8:23 AM
It is a goal of mine to emulate the generosity of @Reply1988!
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Reply1988 -❣️Mother Bean❣️ Underpants buddies for life. 😎
May 28, 2023 at 8:25 AM
So sweet🥰
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Reply1988 -❣️Mother Bean❣️ Underpants buddies for life. 😎
May 28, 2023 at 7:10 AM
I can’t believe I forgot the best ingredient the wedding and children. I like a lovely wedding like in Once Again where it reflected the family characteristics (not a rom com but had some funny moments), What’s wrong with Secretary Kim.
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Reply1988 -❣️Mother Bean❣️ Underpants buddies for life. 😎
May 28, 2023 at 7:16 AM
Sorry I also forgot to mention the proposal. I loved the second lead’s proposal in Fated to love you it is my favourite of all time however I don't want to see this type of first class moment wasted on the second lead. This leads to our hearts being dropped from height and then be stomped on. Why-would-we- want-that-in-a-rom com😐
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Babylilo
May 29, 2023 at 9:20 AM
We must be linked telepathically, because you have exactly described my ideal rom-com. And so thoughtfully and eloquently stated!
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Diana Hansen
May 29, 2023 at 11:12 AM
Yes to all! May hardest one to watch is the evil female playing games which is why I am having trouble watching The Real has Come.
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Qingdao: likes scented candles
May 31, 2023 at 8:45 AM
Well done! Agree!
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7 jerrykuvira
May 28, 2023 at 6:50 AM
Okay. So this might sound dark but I like a rom-com that involves caring for the pair who fell ill or something along that line(Crazy Love). It interests me more when the pair who's doing the caring had a hand in putting the other one in that state(Her Private Life, Crazy Love).
A particular rom-com is one that threaten social strata that lead to walking away from that life(Marriage Contract) or being disowned(Our Blooming Youth).
Another ingredient is bounding over shared tragedy (Just Between Lovers), healing from hurt (Call It Love?, Chocolate).
And then, there's another particular favorite - the office romance that sweeps me off my feet having the boss-employee ingredient (WWWSK, Kiss Sixth Sense, Business Proposal, Her Private Life).
An ingredient I don't want around my perfect rom-com is childhood connections as there's the risk of it being wrongly done almost every time (WWWSK) with only a few using childhood connection trope to land something memorable, thoughtful and provoking(You Are My Spring). If you ain't gonna utilize it as an icing on the cake like YAMS, please don't use this ingredient.
I'm done cooking :)
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Qingdao: likes scented candles
May 31, 2023 at 8:47 AM
Great point on the childhood connections. I have to admit, I loved the adulthood connections in Crash Landing on You, and the format of making it a separate plot by use of epilogues.
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8 Kafiyah Bello
May 28, 2023 at 6:50 AM
A perfect rom com is lighthearted, funny, is about the OTP, has heart fluttering moments, small fights that don't lead to separation, and ends with a proper kiss. It shouldn't really deviate from that. Other things can be there so long as they are connected to the points above. When deviations occur, you end up with serial killers, random couple pairings, marriages that don't work, and weirdo digressions into nonsense.
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Seon-ha
May 28, 2023 at 8:18 AM
I’m 100% on board with the simplicity of this formulation, with maybe the addition of some solid personal growth seen for BOTH leads because that’s my own catnip.
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Kafiyah Bello
May 28, 2023 at 8:26 AM
Yes to personal growth!!
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9 Bunny Sonaki
May 28, 2023 at 6:58 AM
Filtering out serial killers mysteries pschycopaths and stereotypicsl characters like evil second female leads.
Going into depth of the characters and not just handling them at surface level
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Rhena
May 28, 2023 at 7:58 AM
Honestly I've seen only a few romcoms that's character driven,most times their personalities are written to be shallow and just lost in them being in love,I think it's a general thing with the genre or something.
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10 Gikata
May 28, 2023 at 7:03 AM
It should be simply what it says on the tin - combo of romance and comedy, preferably in more or less even parts. Once one genre starts to heavily outweigh another, you know by heart things are going down, so keeping the balance is crucial. Other notable ingredients, just like @anniemo said, include OTP chemistry (without it all is futile), good humor (subjective), pace that's neither too slow nor overwhelming and, I strongly believe, overall lighthearted, warm and hopeful vibe that gives viewers mood boost and
winged insect parasitesbutterflies. That's all for objective ingredients)))Now a super personal catnip - OTP should be more or less on equal footing with their feelings during most of the show's run. I know, I know - majority strongly prefer "he falls first and harder" trope, but that just doesn't sit well for me. I find prolonged one-sided affection sad and pitiful, not something to aggressively swoon over. There are exceptions ofc, but in a romcoms specifically this is a must for me. One person not fully realizing their feelings - that are there and we as viewers can clearly see it - for some time is fine, but a total one-way street devotion for half of episodes or longer? Nah, keep it, I don't watch romcoms to get frustrated! Also I prefer my romcoms about adults on the spicier side, but that's even more subjective and if all the other ingredients work well, I can forgive the show for lack of scorching hotness. Kinda^^
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wonhwa
May 28, 2023 at 7:26 AM
I'm with you on mutual attraction and spiciness - one sided pining starts to feel a lot like stalking, and if you're going to focus on adult romance, it drives me nuts when shows fail to acknowledge that sexual attraction is (usually) a key part of that. I'm fine with a slow burn but not a relationship that builds to the world's chastest dead fish kiss.
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Gikata
May 28, 2023 at 8:58 AM
No kiss at all is better than a dead fish one))) Same with skinship - dramas love to tease audience with fanservice scenes of "almost there!" variety and then give us flat and awkward actual physical interactions thinking that's enough because hey, leads are touching each other for real this time, be happy with it! Ugh, so annoying.
It's probably another unpopular opinion, but I think that slow burns are overrated, at least in light romcoms. It's one thing to take time with relationship progressing from "first spark of interest" to "true love" to make it feel organic, but man, kdramas do take this trope WAY too far too often. Getting impression that OTP are literally fighting their attraction to each other for some silly reason (mostly just to drag the plot to fill episode count) is one of the things I hate the most about this genre. If you don't want to be together that much, why even bother? There are plenty of other genres where such romantic angst actually makes sense.
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Rhena
May 28, 2023 at 10:24 AM
Oh no😂
You and your unending banters about how you hate melodramas
The characters in romcoms are written on a surface level and most times their personalities are just lost in them "being in love" the wicked mother in law doesn't matter, the social status doesn't matter the characters try not to think of all those possible barriers as long as there's "love". It's something to watch,if you like that type of vibe and all while romance melos go deeper with the characters and sensitise them , how they feel with whatever is stopping them from being fully together , the reasons are meant to be empathised with the audience and create some angst of some sort, but some people aren't interested in that so I see why you can't like them but I honestly don't think any of the genres are overrated,i think they're both written for different audiences or something.
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Gikata
May 28, 2023 at 11:03 AM
I am a proud melo
hatercritic (actually not so much - romantic angst CAN be good with the right genre, setting and overall approach), but that was not the point though? I simply stated my confusion over why people tent to love slow burn in romcoms of all things where lightheartedness of the genre actually calls for faster and hotter, well, burn))) This I just don't get, it looks like conflicting flavors situation to me. Slow burn's greatest merit is how deep and nuanced it is, and like you said, deep and nuanced is not exactly what romcoms are known and loved for. So that's where the problem lies - too many dramas present themselves as romcoms but actually are either something completely different under the surface OR abruptly switch genres midway. Which is, to put it bluntly, a scam. This brings us to my initial point - for a romcom to be considered good it should just be what it present itself as - a romcom. True one. Simple as that. But yeah, maybe I'm demanding too much)))wonhwa
May 28, 2023 at 11:01 AM
I'm fine with a flirty, fun tease of a slow burn, especially in a rom-com - less fine with a angsty miserable one. And of course, this assumes there actually is a payoff at some point - otherwise, why bother?
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Gikata
May 28, 2023 at 11:19 AM
Right, I was talking specifically about the angsty one - teasing and flirting is fun, as long as it doesn't last AGES with no real progress to back it up. Then again, it's probably up to debate whether OTP actively and knowingly flirting with each other for a while even counts as a slow burn. You know, such things can get pretty close to the boiling point if done with the right effort...
Kathryn51
May 29, 2023 at 11:23 AM
I love the slow burn but agree with you when it takes too long. I think it might be one reason that more recent dramas as pared down to 12-14 episodes. 16 (for a rom com) is just too long because it almost always means that there will be a murder mystery (Crash Course in Romance); childhood makjang moment (Her Private Life - still one of my favorites, but those last 2 episodes were awful); or Meddling Grandfather (or other wealthy head of the family) demanding a split (Something about 1%).
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Gikata
May 29, 2023 at 11:37 AM
You forgot another classics - exes/stalkerish admirers that just refuse to get lost no matter)))
11 Kurama
May 28, 2023 at 7:16 AM
First, a good couple. If the actors have great chemistry and can sell me their love story, I can bear a lot.
I don't mind tropes at all. I don't think I need an original story neither. It's more the execution that is important.
It's better when we can enjoy the couple together at least for a couple of scenes and not just them ending together in the last scene of the drama...
Great kiss scenes! It's so frustrating when we got a good couple, their love story makes sense but the kiss scene is bad because it looks like kids or we see nothing, etc.
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Rhena
May 28, 2023 at 7:49 AM
Oh
Thank you so much for this,I forgot to add this too, because most times we can see the leads are ages 26-30 or 30-40 and we get a bland kiss or staring into the eyes for daysss, like these are adults not kids!!! I don't really fancy the ferocious spicy scenes in western shows but at least it shouldn't be that bland in Kdramas either.
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HopefulRomantic 🦋 Tigermoth 🦞
May 28, 2023 at 9:18 AM
"I don't mind tropes at all. I don't think I need an original story neither. It's more the execution that is important." ⬅️ Absolutely!! One of the things I really enjoy about K-dramas ARE the tropes and genre conventions. I think it all comes down to the execution of the story with directing, and the spark between the leads.
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Ally
May 28, 2023 at 12:54 PM
You’ve said everything I look for too. The chemistry between leads is the MOST important thing for me in a romance, but I think that’s the point.
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Babylilo
May 29, 2023 at 9:39 AM
There’s a good reason there are so many videos out there of just the kiss scenes in a drama; they are the moments many of us want to watch again and again!
I enjoy drama kisses more when they are between mature adults (30+) who clearly have some experience in the smooch department, and when the impulse to lock lips is mutual. I also love it when when it’s the woman who initiates the kiss—though we don’t see it very often.
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12 Rhena
May 28, 2023 at 7:31 AM
When watching romcoms my reasoning flies out the window, they're mostly so cringe, unrealistic for some part and cheesy,but it's quite obvious that they're written for that effect,it might not be my favourite genre but I watch one or two whenever I'm done with an emotionally draining show.
Things I like;
1. An office setting: my favourite romcoms all have an office setting like secretary Kim ,business proposal.
2. A second love interest: This plot device is hated by many,but I love seeing it in romcoms idk why, even if there isn't a constant second love interest , there should at least be a guy thay makes the male lead go all jello whenever he's near the female lead.
3. The leads having besties
4. Bonus points if it's an enemies to lovers trope.
5. Side couples
Things I don't enjoy in romcoms
1. "I met you as a child", like sometimes it's cute but sometimes it's written and added in a way to convince the audience that the couples are actually "meant to be together" and that's the basis of true love .
2. Traumatic memories: This is a plot device I noticed first in Kdramas and disliked it instantly.
I respect it in shows similar to good bad mother, it's okay not to be okay since they're built on the effects of childhood trauma,schema patterns, behavioural patterns and all but not in romcoms because most times they're just drawn out for long without depth and inconsistent, like let the romcom just remain breezy and fluffy. It's one of the things that spoiled secretary Kim for me , like I know PTSD is real but sometimes just like the childhood trope ,it seems like the writer incorporates it in the drama because it's a compulsory plot device. Just like the childhood trope,if it's executed properly and convincingly I won't have much issues with it.
4. Returning exes : This is just a no. I think I can even pass the childhood and traumatic experience trope cuz sometimes the exes do the worse things and still expect to get together with the ML especially when she's seen he's moved on with the Fl like just No😂.
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cozybooks
May 30, 2023 at 10:40 PM
I just have to second your "the leads having besties" mention. I love it when both of them have someone they can talk to and soundboard off of.
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13 mmmmm
May 28, 2023 at 9:20 AM
My perfect romcoms are like A Business Proposal, Sh**ting Stars, Coffee Prince, and Waikiki 2. As their name suggests, they need to be romantic and funny. I can’t like a romcom if our humors don’t match. A great romcom must have some scenes that can make me laugh like crazy *cues Samantha and Rachel* *cues “Do you know what my love and this card have in common? They’re unlimited”*
And likeable characters as an ensemble cast.
Keeping things light is always preferred.
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14 Blue (@mayhemf)
May 28, 2023 at 9:40 AM
Romcom
Firstly, the OTP! I need to see their chemistry. Any form of chemistry. That’s the key to a good romcom.
Then, I like both leads to be individuals with distinct personalities. They can be flawed but not bland. I like to to see a couple getting to know each other and falling in love gradually. They can bicker, fight, flirt do whatever along the process and I don’t care. During this phase I don’t care what tropes they throw at me, I embrace them all.
Another thing I really like is when the guy falls for the girl first. Don’t ask me why, but I love it when the guy falls first (sooner the better)!
Any misunderstanding needs to be because of the couple. I hate external factors being cause of misunderstandings unless it’s really done well.
I like to see the couple work through their issues and come out stronger.
I like to see physical intimacy. It just doesn’t need to be hugs and kisses but any form of intimacy is a big win for me.
And lastly, don’t veer away from OTP. Keep the focus on them. Don’t start side couples, serial killers etc and take the focus away from OTP.
Probably the reason why ‘Weightlifting Fairy Kim Bok-Joo’ remains my top rom-com till date.
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mmmmm
May 28, 2023 at 4:45 PM
Weightlifting Fairy is also one of my faves!
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15 Snow Flower
May 28, 2023 at 10:07 AM
Romance and comedy.
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16 lillamy
May 28, 2023 at 12:43 PM
My most favorite thing about rom-coms are when the cast obviously are on great terms with each other. That ease in which conversation and romance flow is all it takes to make a memorable drama to me. But I do love me some sweet relatives, loyal friends and being up front with each other to avoid misunderstandings.
The things I hate are 30-year olds acting 17 or even 12 in their mannerism. Second lead characters who can't step back gracefully and when a drama ends with a wedding. The last is a scar I contracted by reading too much Nora Roberts in my youth.
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Gikata
May 28, 2023 at 3:16 PM
Was ready to argue with you over that last point but then remembered I now carry a severe drama wedding phobia that won't go away anytime soon, so yeah, +1 on that for the time being. Let all OTPs live happily and peacefully in a sin!
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lillamy
May 30, 2023 at 9:59 PM
I wouldn't have a problem with it if the story continued some time past the wedding, but the whole thing about a wedding being the pinnacle of the story is just classic Cinderella and bad. Weddings are expensive, stressful and tiring and does not guarantee a happy ever after and I would appreciate also this being depicted. Again, severely damaged by Nora Roberts.
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Gikata
May 31, 2023 at 6:30 AM
Well, depicting realistic relationship struggles in romcom is a tricky choice for obvious reasons... Consumers of the genre want uplifting fantasy, not mundane problems)))
Tell me about stressful irl weddings lol. My eldest cousin's one included 300+ guests from our side only, for example. And it was just CLOSEST relatives and friends on the first day, everyone else had to be treated and entertained in the following week... Even remembering it makes me shudder.
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GetawayJunkie
May 28, 2023 at 11:10 PM
I hate weddings too!
I'm okay with proposals but I hate weddings. I think it is so cliched. Not all weddings means happily ever after, and likewise, not all happily ever after includes a wedding.
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17 hacja
May 28, 2023 at 1:03 PM
I first started watching Korean rom-coms because of the generally strong and interesting female leads. The tropes were also for the most part really amusing, and the best rom-coms employed them in self-aware ways.
But I noticed almost immediately that, again for the most part, the main rule governing male romantic leads was to portray them as cold, dominant, often arrogant characters, that needed to be broken down and/or given therapy by romantic love. Even if the female lead is portrayed as initially superior in self-awareness, compassion, and situational intelligence, its not until the male lead succumbs to her charms that he actually grants her equal status, and they can progress toward love. (Then, in the worst case scenario, immediately some situation arises that requires the male lead to decide that it would be better for the woman if he nobly gave her up without of course talking to her about it. Touch your Heart still makes me steam because of this exact sequence.)
So even apart from love triangles, white truck accidents, time skips, childhood meetups, secondary relationships, etc. etc. I’m going to be yelling about the behavior of the male character about 3/4s of all kdrama rom-coms. (Fortunately, in my true life rom-com, my wife is able to laugh at me)
Weirdly this means that even though I watch the rom-com because of my interest in female characters, I’m not going to really appreciate it unless the male character is portrayed as not just good-looking and or rich and or talented --one of those is pretty much a given-- but also courteous and decently behaved from the beginning. (They can still be cold, or be troubled by trauma. They just need to have some manners and show some basic consideration.
It is interesting how few rom-coms have an initially sympathetic male lead. Most of my favorites do-- Weightlifting Fairy, mentioned above and one of one of my favorites, does; actually Her Private Life, where its true the artist/museum director is initially cold, he shows his decency when he gives up his hotel room because he believes the female lead and her friend are in a lesbian relationship and need privacy; even in Business Proposal, the chaebol is from the beginning, clearly a down to earth guy outside of work.
So while I’ll always stick with a rom-com if the female lead is a strong character, pretty much a given in kdramas--albeit being very vocal if the male lead is an arrogant or noble idiot--I’ll only truly enjoy it if the male lead is her equal in compassion and understanding (pretty rare!)
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Seon-ha
May 28, 2023 at 2:14 PM
Would you mind giving your thoughts on Secretary Kim? I’d be interested to hear your POV!
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hacja
May 28, 2023 at 7:47 PM
@attiton, thanks for being interested in my opinion--I'm really flattered. I hope this POV doesn't disappoint you.
But WWSK is exactly what I'm talking about. An extraordinarily competent administrator is treated as a menial personal assistant by an arrogant boss. That is the opening of the rom-com, and I intensely and vocally disliked him from the start.
Of course, by the end, its clear that he loved her from the beginning-shockingly, even from childhood--can you imagine! , and he has presumably learned to treat her with the respect and consideration she deserves. But why the need for that beginning?
Also, there is the element that in this day and age can't be ignored--he is her boss. So the taint of sexual exploitation of a work subordinate really does hang over this one.
On the other hand, I always enjoy workplace romances, and this one had an outstanding supporting cast which was really funny, even though I was expressing my dismay throughout!
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Seon-ha
May 29, 2023 at 6:10 AM
Oh, this was a question openly and honestly asked—the only space for disappointment would have arisen from a lack of response. But here we are! Thanks so much for taking the time.
I think your use of the word “presumably” above is the key to my misgivings. I don’t know that he does actually change. He is the same guy from beginning to end. Yes, one trying to do what’s best for others—but never by talking to them, or asking them what they need. This is true for him with regards to Mi-so, his best friend, his parents, and, critically, his brother (who I actually had a great deal of sympathy for because he eventually did seem to truly change/want to heal).
Thanks again!
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Rhena
May 28, 2023 at 2:46 PM
I've noticed this normal plot formulas in most romcoms not just in Kdramas but also in Western romcoms and novels mostly feature a cold arrogant male lead and an opposite female lead or a female lead that's obnoxious or purposefully dismisses his advances(secretary Kim). So I really can't blame you for wanting something different. Although I personally know I can't stand obnoxious and arrogant men in real life.It's a normal formula in romcoms and I think it's just hilarious, the chase,bickers, banters and everything 😂
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hacja
May 28, 2023 at 7:55 PM
Its true, it was a model at least since Pride and Prejudice. But there are degrees of male obnoxiousness! Also, I know many obnoxious men, but my friends are all really kind and considerate, and not so coincidently, have been happily married a long time. So I know the alternative is out there, for a happy fantasy rom-com. If the respectful partner was shown even half of the time, I wouldn't complain--bickers and bantering have their place even in happy relationships. Its just that for first half of the majority of rom-coms, I causing a ruckus in front of the T.V!
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wonhwa
May 28, 2023 at 3:39 PM
The cold, rich, asshat male lead saved by the spunky Candy heroine is one of my least favorite tropes ever. I'm fine if both parties are "difficult", especially if their strengths and weaknesses compliment each other, but the whole "I can make an abusive man (or woman) better through the power of my love" thing is usually one the fastest ways to get me to drop a drama.
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Rhena
May 29, 2023 at 12:00 AM
I really get what u're saying. It's really nice if the main leads are both flawed and difficult where you could see both of them challenging themselves rather than it being one sided,and I've noticed that most times that rests on the FL whose character is written as supposedly flawless and expected to please the audience😂
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bong-soo
May 28, 2023 at 6:23 PM
I am a crime guy so romance is not my strong suit as a kdrama genre but I strolled down to get your comment @hacja. Bravo!
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hacja
May 28, 2023 at 8:39 PM
Thanks @marcusnyc20. Fortunately, you don't have to watch a rom-com with me to listen to my fulminations at the inconsiderate male lead!
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18 thimble
May 28, 2023 at 4:43 PM
A great rom-com has to be funny or at least make me smile. Sometimes that means exposing the characters to ridicule or be in humiliating situations that we would frown on in this country as bad taste or incorrect thinking (because we in the US take ourselves so very, very seriously) and to get into these situations, the characters often have to have secrets and tell lies that lead to misunderstandings that entrap them, like in My Father is Strange. They also need to have strong personalities even while showing vulnerability, as in My Lovely Kim Sam-soon, so that sparks can fly, ratcheting up the sexual tension. Then, there needs to be competing possible alternate partners who provoke jealousy and increase the tension and push-pull even more. With snappy dialogue, clever writing and directing, I’m in rom-com heaven. Finally, a rom-com can do all the right things and have all the right tropes and still be mediocre because it lacks that secret something (looking at you, Love to Hate You).
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Rhena
May 29, 2023 at 12:21 AM
Oh
I thought I was the only one who thought "love to hate you" wasn't just it.
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19 LaurenSophie
May 28, 2023 at 4:47 PM
I used to say that I would sit through most any romance if the main couple had real chemistry (and, conversely, that no matter how good the writing and story, I wouldn't make it through a romcom in which the main couple had limited chemistry), but I've since realized that that's not entirely true. I've now seen a few romcoms where the central couple objectively had great chemistry, but the story and/or writing wasn't doing it for me, so I tuned out. Recent examples:
--Joseon Attorney (not technically a romcom, but the main couple had very sparky chemistry and yet I could not stop my mind and gaze from wandering)
--Our Blooming Youth (also not technically a romcom, but another example of a central couple with great chemistry but after about 12 episodes I no longer cared for the drama because the story completely wasted their potential)
--True to Love (I did finish this one, but the strong chemistry between the leads wasn't enough to make this one a romcom success)
Moving on from chemistry, here are some things I never want to see in romcoms again:
--the CPR "kiss" (it's first aid, not a kiss!!!!)
--The literal and slo-mo slip and fall into each other's arms
--Closed mouth kisses, especially when one participant keeps their eyes open
--Adults in their 30s acting like they're going to spontaneously combust when their hands brush
--The idea that once you've had sex with the person with whom you're so desperately in love you're good and never need or want to do it again
--Someone calling their love interest a pervert, even in a jokey way, when that person initiates kissing or sex with the person they're dating
--Overbearing parents physically attacking their grown child in their 20s, 30s, or 40s, for spending the night (even platonically) with their girlfriend/boyfriend
--Homophobia in the form of misunderstandings about the male lead's sexuality that lead to cringey jokes or more physical attacks from parents
What I Want to See More Of:
--Male jealousy. In real-life, jealousy is an ugly, toxic emotion in most relationships but in dramas, I love it. In classic romance novels, there was always a "mine" moment where the hero would get territorial and reveal his true feelings to the reader by exploding into possessiveness if another man merely looked at his woman. Again, gross in real life, but the kdrama equivalent of this--especially when the actor is good at micro-expressions--is so gratifying. And often very funny, too.
--Casual Displays of Affection: Western media does this very well, but Asian dramas tend to shy away from depicting the little things real couples do all the time. For example, most couples, even those who don't like to engage in PDA, tend to casually touch each other all the time, kiss hello and/or goodbye, put their arms around each other, etc. "Good Bad Mother" is one recent exception where we got to see a couple--Mi-joo and Kang-ho--do all of these things, and it really stood out...
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LaurenSophie
May 28, 2023 at 4:47 PM
because it's so rare. Sure, there's a lot of hype in romcoms about the first handhold, hug, kiss, etc. but there's often very little of the mundane, everyday affectionate gestures and touches that make a fictional couple look like a real one.
--Finally, I love it when there's the just-right amount of angst or loneliness to make the eventual coming together of the protagonists all the sweeter. Pining protagonists, especially with a stoic ML, really get me. "My Liberation Notes" did this beautifully when Gu and Mi-jeong are apart. Same with "Call it Love." And because those aren't really romcoms, let me also add "Mr. Queen" to the list--when the two are apart and our FL thinks the ML is dead, but then they are reunited it's so, so good. I get chills even now.
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mmmmm
May 28, 2023 at 5:00 PM
Live Up to Your Name really came to mind. It is one great romcom (though I liked it a bit less in my second watch).
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Rhena
May 29, 2023 at 12:28 AM
I love everything about your explanation,I agree with them all especially on the male jealousy,the ML shouldn't be stalkerish or too obsessive but I really like when there's some form of protectiveness and little jealousy stares from the male lead it's just hilarious and you had me at the CPR kisses🤣 I think everyone is getting annoyed with such kisses now😂
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Babylilo
May 29, 2023 at 10:04 AM
“ The idea that once you've had sex with the person with whom you're so desperately in love you're good and never need or want to do it again.”
Oh, god, I hate this scenario, and yet you see it in so many dramas. One of the reasons I loved PRETTY NOONA, despite all its flaws, was that once the lead couple got together they couldn’t keep their hands off each other, and were always looking for opportunities to “get it on.”
Speaking of noona romances, I admit to being a sucker for the genre, especially when it’s treated as normal, or not even mentioned at all. I’m currently watching GLORY, and am surprised that no one has brought up the age difference between the main couple; the female lead is 14 years older than the male lead. I’m wondering whether we’re just expected to think of them as being close to the same age, despite the obvious difference? Maybe it does come up later in the drama, so I’ll wait and see.
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Reply1988 -❣️Mother Bean❣️ Underpants buddies for life. 😎
May 29, 2023 at 9:34 PM
Pretty Noona visually presented ‘this is what love is like in the early stages’ perfectly and then put that mood to music in the song Something in the rain.
I think this is why when the music and the actions on screen went wrong I felt so betrayed 😡 the potential that could have been…
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Babylilo
May 30, 2023 at 4:51 AM
I choose to remember everything up to the stupid part. For the rest of it, I employ “selective amnesia,” which is a safe alternative to throwing things at the TV screen! 🙄
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Seon-ha
May 30, 2023 at 4:58 AM
Can we register “selective amnesia” as another Beanie Superpower, @elinor?
20 HopefulRomantic 🦋 Tigermoth 🦞
May 28, 2023 at 5:14 PM
I love rom-coms, especially when romance AND comedy are balanced throughout. I think it's tough to keep the plot of a drama centered around a romantic relationship from imploding or exploding (as many Beanie discussions have pointed out), and one thing that helps is keeping a wider focus than just the OTP - and that's where the comedy comes in. When I think about rom-coms (and rom-drams), I think the central plot conflict necessary to a narrative climax and denouement is either internal, or external. By internal, I mean the conflicts arise from within the couple themselves - miscommunication, misunderstanding, noble idiocy, letting the other half think you're dead, etc. etc. This is my least favorite method of plot conflict - it's so stressful!! External plot conflicts would be the difference in class/status, conniving SML/SFL, disapproving family, serial killers, etc. In general, as long as the couple tackles these obstacles together, I much prefer the external conflicts (yes, even the murder subplots, as long as it doesn't change the tone to a thriller).
A few examples that come to mind of dramas that handled the romance/comedy balance well have also been listed by other Beanies: Her Private Life, Business Proposal, Sh**ting Stars (*still watching and enjoying!*). I think that an excellent example of this type is Memorials/Into the Ring, because even though it isn't really a rom-com, it did ALL the rom-com things so well! The first time I watched it, I watched anxiously, waiting for the other shoe to drop - the noble idiocy, the last 25% breakup, the disappearance of the comedy (or romance). But it never happened! The OTP supported each other to the end of the drama, I loved it. On the flip side, I absolutely loved the OTP in Crazy Love and their relationship progression, which was both romantic AND funny; but the external plot conflicts revolving around the twisted angsty stuff of the last 25% soured a lot of the joy from the excellent couple. So to summarize, a rom-com needs ROM and COM to stay throughout, and while the OTP can make or break a drama, the plot that holds them up can also let them down.
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wonhwa
May 28, 2023 at 6:07 PM
I also usually prefer external conflicts, which may also be why I tend to like my romances embedded either in period settings or in other genres where there are compelling forces that might genuinely pull the couple apart. If there's a law that nobles can't marry commoners or there's a war on or one half of the couple is ruling the country it feels much more natural that a relationship might not proceed smoothly.
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HopefulRomantic 🦋 Tigermoth 🦞
May 28, 2023 at 6:12 PM
I absolutely agree!! I think I usually feel much more invested in those romances, too. I really, really enjoy rom-coms, but unless there's something bigger or deeper going on, I rarely love them.
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21 too_much_tv
May 28, 2023 at 5:30 PM
The essential ingredient for me in romance is the resolution of misunderstandings and conflicts. This means that in order to have the pleasure of romance, I have to have the suffering of romance, which is observing stupid miscommunications and conflicts! I also think that a good romance is one where each partner gets the thing they are missing--someone to stick up for them, or someone who thinks highly of them, or someone who understands how they feel. It can't only be, "oh hey, you're hot, let's smooch," though I recognize that physical attraction is an important thing in romance.
I sometimes feel weird about how good looking the actors are in k-dramas. If the person is super hot and also cheerful, hardworking, friendly and kind, why aren't they already married? This is one reason that BL dramas can be effective--maybe he's not out of the closet and that's how no one has snapped him up already? But I also sometimes feel that, even with your regular degular straight couple, there has to be some kind of complication to stop the lead POV person from already having a partner. Like, say, a terrible crushing debt that forces the person to work constantly. K-dramas have a lot of misunderstanding related to hardship.
Anyway, I really like a romance where the love helps one (or both!) partners realize their potential or find happiness in place of misery or just generally get better at life. Take, for example, Because This Is My First Life. At the end, the protagonist has support for being a writer and her dear love is actually positively happy. I mean, it's not the most dramatic example, but it is satisfying.
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22 ar_arguably romantic
May 28, 2023 at 5:41 PM
I feel like a lot of stuff is subjective - even perception of chemistry can get into subjective territory because different people can find different things romantic. Something as mundane as straightening a piece of wall art that is hanging slightly crooked can be like "be still my heart!". Interactions that I found indicative of romantic-soulmate-hood in my teens and twenties are different from what I'm finding now. I'm really into seeing two people who can work together well or who can uplift each other (but not in a "I'll fix you" way).
I don't know the exact ingredients for a perfect rom-com, but I would really just like seeing supportive supporting characters. Warm ensembles, so I don't feel like I have to endure the uninteresting villains eating up half the screentime in order to watch the parts that I do like. I want to enjoy all the scenes, even the ones not featuring the OTP.
I do think that the comedy (whether it be humor or just people being happy and positive) element needs to be distributed generously and evenly. Otherwise, it is just a romance. Which then reminds me - which dramas are really rom-coms and which ones are really romances with some comedy. Like would Alchemy of Souls really be considered a rom-com when the two primary genres are fantasy and romance?
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lapislazulii
May 28, 2023 at 7:13 PM
"I found indicative of romantic-soulmate-hood in my teens and twenties are different from what I'm finding now" yes to this!!
I was rewatching some old rom-com movies with some friends other day and it was so interesting to observe how much our viewpoints on what 'romantic-souldmate-hood' looks like has changed dramatically since we first saw some of those movies as pre-teens & teens. Of course this comes with growing up and all that but it's fascinating all the same how it keeps evolving through life! Especially when teen me thought she knew everything there was to know and was SO sure that certain tropes (which I now cringe at) were the most romantic things EVER. I wonder which of the tropes I'm treasuring now, as the elite standard for romance, will make the me-in-10-years look back and cringe at 😂
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23 MikeyD signed up
May 28, 2023 at 6:21 PM
This is an easy one. Conversations. The pair just talking to each other. It doesn't matter the topic, it can be about the antonym for 'cute', as long as they're talking it makes me happy. What especially makes me happy is if they're still talking after the love line has been wrapped up. They're now together... and they're still having conversations.
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MikeyD signed up
May 28, 2023 at 6:26 PM
Additional. What do 'Melo Is My Nature' and 'Happiness' have in common? The two leads just talking - not at each other but to each other.
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cozybooks
May 30, 2023 at 10:44 PM
I also relate to this. It's just fun to watch two people get to really talk with each other.
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Kas61
May 31, 2023 at 8:20 PM
This is one of the reasons I watch Weighlifting Fairy again and again... the banter between them, right from the start, is absolutely topnotch. There's a whole series of different conversations they have throughout which are hilarious/snarky/flirtatious -- one of my favourites is when Joo-hyuk is waiting round for Bok-Joo after her "date" with his older brother, and they then spend the evening together flirting/bantering/tormenting each other. Highlights being the hilarious role reversal of the guy protecting the girl from the car splash, and then at the frog pond him shutting his eyes thinking she was going to kiss him and she sneezes in his face and taunts him that her germs are just as tough as she is... top notch dialogue writing through out.
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24 lapislazulii
May 28, 2023 at 6:53 PM
I really enjoy a 'soft' meet cute where the 'meet cute' bit is actually stretched over a few different small interactions. Fireworks at first sight or other super dramatic first meets can be entertaining but nothing else gets my heart fluttering than just quiet curiosity, a lingering look and/or a few awkward pauses and stilted sentences. There's just something so vulnerably beautiful about these kinds of meet cutes and they set the tone well for the rest of the rom-com!!
There's so many examples but three that come immediately to mind:
- Moment at Eighteen: when Soo-bin goes to see if Joon-woo is okay
bc her mum almost hit him, and she makes him do this adorable little stretch to check he's okay and then stammers her way through small talk while he just smiles at her.
- 25-21: after Ye-jin pulls Hee-do out from the club, they have a small conversation and she turns to leave when he calls out to her, and there is the most gorgeous split-second hesitation before he asks her what her name is. I think I replayed that scene countless times! Something about it made my heart skip a beat.
- A Piece Of Your Mind: When Seo-woo finds Ha-won in the recording studio and realises he's the person who's been leaving the place a mess the past few days.
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lapislazulii
May 28, 2023 at 6:58 PM
Lol I realise after writing this that all of these are romance melodramas 😂 I was too focused on the romance! I suppose the comedy aspect of rom-coms requires a bit more of that extra energy so usually the meet-cutes are more towards the fireworks end!
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25 bewitched
May 28, 2023 at 8:09 PM
The producer, writer, and actors have to be able to build a world that matches the current taste of their target audiences at the time the drama aired. It’s essential because people’s standard changes from time to time.
I used to love Hyun Bin in Secret Garden, but now as I’m older, I feel that his character doesn’t actually have some qualities that make me swoon. And that’s because I grow older and my view of swoony male lead has changed. The drama itself doesn’t change and it was a huge hit back then, so the production for sure nailed it.
I really enjoyed Business Proposal during the time it was aired, but let’s see in 10 years 😂.
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petrolia
May 28, 2023 at 11:37 PM
Re: Business Proposal: or just 10 days! I enjoyed it while I watched it, and I still hold the main couple mostly in high regards (especially him). But I had second thoughts about the secondary couple which have only increased over time...by now there's not much sympathy left for them (or her as her supposed best friend. Some of her actions would have made me recoil and refrain from the relationship for good!).
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Rhena
May 29, 2023 at 12:11 AM
What actions?
She was my favourite character and a good friend to the Fl
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petrolia
May 29, 2023 at 2:38 AM
Well there was this scene where they went shopping, she thrust a few clothes and a make over on her "best friend" just to leave her alone in front of their then-menace without any kind of preparation. That is so no best-friendy on so many levels...for me, that would have been it.
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Rhena
May 29, 2023 at 9:27 AM
Ohh
Maybe you've experienced something personal and you took offence by it but she was mostly so supportive of her and helpful to her in other scenes and episodes that I didn't see anything that serious with the scene u're referring to,idk.
mmmmm
May 30, 2023 at 9:07 AM
I for one didnt really root for the secondary couple. I feel like their relationship seems superficial to me.
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Unaspirated
May 31, 2023 at 10:16 AM
I had reservations about the secondary couple too, but most people seem really to love them. I thought they were cute until they slept together - or rather, he slept with her while she was super drunk and couldn't consent. Creepy. When she woke up the next morning in his apartment, I was honestly expecting a fake-out where she thinks they slept together but really they just hung out, she said a bunch of embarrassing things, and fell asleep in his bed. When I realized that's not the direction the drama was going I was really uncomfortable. And I didn't love their ending where he just becomes a trophy husband and waits for his friend to come back. But I loved the main couple.
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petrolia
June 1, 2023 at 1:55 AM
Yes, I didn't like that as well. It would have even fit better into the general mood and narrative if she just thought it might have happened, but he would have acted like the gentleman he was initially portrayed as and just layed her fown on the sofa with a plaid and watched over her. But to take advantage of her drunken state...not cool.
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26 redfox
May 28, 2023 at 11:01 PM
oftentimes the romance would have been a fail and fallen apart lest for best friends or mentors / father figures pushing it. Meddlers or rather, someone who puts some sense in the heads of the noble idiots slash hesitants. and the best friend can be either the blunt type who shocks them into realisation, or the undercover agent type, who is smooth and sneaky.
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27 petrolia
May 28, 2023 at 11:31 PM
I'm a bad customer when it comes to romcoms because they mostly throw me off - by misunderstandings that could be solved easily, cringey behaviour, noble idiocy...so my perfect romcom ingredient is the absence of those things.
I like a couple that has chemistry and a believable reason why they might like each other. My perfect example: Just between Lovers (it's not a romCOM, I know!). They are such a believable example of mutual attraction! And chemistry.
Or just give me a believable reason where that spark of interest comes from.
Then I like it when they talk. I hate these drawn out misunderstandings because they don't when it would be so easy to solve something by just opening your mouth and ask / tell! Same goes for obstacles - especially when they are already a couple: don't let one of them deal with hardships while the other one stays in the dark. Let them solve things together! That can be fun to watch, too. That is something I'll never understand - those plotlines where one part of the couple tries to hide things from the other when, as a couple, you'll get nowhere when you'll act that way and it would be a such more satisfying thing to watch -at least for me - how these two deal together with something.
And I second what others have already mentioned: don't let people in their mid-thirties act like teenagers when they've accidentally touched someone. Especially: please, let grown women act like grown women. Maybe it's just me, but women constantly belittling themselves and overturning the aegyo just makes my blood boil.
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28 jlharv
May 29, 2023 at 10:45 AM
There is the ‘Must’, the ‘Preferred’, and the ‘Please Never Again’.
When it comes to rom-coms, chemistry between the leads is a must. Now you may be thinking, “we’ll, duh,” but there are so many highly regarded rom-coms in both the KDrama world and Hollywood (which is something I’m more familiar with) that lack in chemistry. I just finished a top tier KDrama and I wasn’t convinced the couple had chemistry. The male lead was charismatic. That was a disguise for chemistry but I could easily see the female lead replaced and no one would feel robbed. Chemistry is the foundation for any rom-com and I believe it can’t be faked or disguised.
My preferred trope is ‘Mistaken Identity’. Now let me be clear. This isn’t a suspenseful mistaken identity. Usually, it’s one person pretending to be someone else knowing full well who the other is… like a prank or a trick. Think in terms of ‘Business Proposal’ or (if you like Hollywood) ‘How to Lose a Guy in 10 Days’ or ‘You’ve Got Mail’. This is usually where some of the best comedy appears in my opinion. The ‘Mistaken Identity’ is a whole lotta physical comedy and outrageous reactions trying to hide who they are to protect their trick. It also gets the audience happily squirming waiting for the moment when the trick is discovered. As far as I can tell, not many KDramas have mistaken identity. Correct me if I’m wrong.
The ‘Please Never Again’ is the childhood connection. It cheapens the present day story of our romantic couple. I believe that two adults fall in love because the current version of each other is the best and most complimentary. This trope says: you can only find love if you had a 10 minute connection with someone when you were both kids.
Me: Yeah, but I want the relationship to mean something to me because of who i am as an adult.
KDramas: No. Your feelings and maturity are not as meaningful as the 10 min connection 22 years ago.
Me: Did I truly know anything 22 years ago?
KDramas: No. But 10 min of cute kids is apparently more fulfilling than 16 hours of adult connection.
Me: (judgmental) Sure.
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Isa is always time travelling
May 30, 2023 at 12:58 AM
"As far as I can tell, not many KDramas have mistaken identity. Correct me if I’m wrong".
"Start-Up" comes to my mind. Have you watched it?
Outside "com" territory, "Youth of May" plays with mistaken identity too (starting exactly as "Business Proposal").
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zk
June 3, 2023 at 12:47 PM
have not yet watched those, but others with elements of mistaken identity: she was pretty, coffee prince, secret garden, oh my venus.
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jlharv
June 18, 2023 at 4:24 PM
I haven't watched 'Start Up' but its a high priority on my list. Thank you for confirming that.
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Isa is always time travelling
June 19, 2023 at 12:03 AM
I loved Start-up. I hope you like it too :)
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Midnight
May 30, 2023 at 1:56 AM
I love How To Lose A Guy in Ten Days because the deception went two ways. But I hate when it is one way and it is meant as a prank, or personal gain, and goes on for too long.
In Start-up the lie started very innocently and kinda got out of hands, and they felt miserable. It was very relatable actually. It was much better than some shows where they make a fool of one of the leads and the lie just goes on and on for the sake of creating comedy or conflict or whatever.
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29 MikeyD signed up
May 29, 2023 at 2:45 PM
Someone wrote (or said on a podcast, I forget which) that good romance dramas are character-based, not story-based. Don't keep interrupting the pair with 'plot' that nobody really cases about. cool it with the chaebol heir drama, no serial killer drama, no emergency medical condition drama. Focus on the pair interacting with just enough story to keep throwing them together.
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30 OldLawyer
May 29, 2023 at 4:37 PM
First- I like to have our OTP be people on the same level. Strong man matched with a strong woman, A shy man with a shy woman, etc. I want a sense of two people who belong together because they fit each other well. Or, as an alternative, two people who fit with each other not because they are alike but because each brings what the other is missing- this last can be the very best of all.
There should actually be real comedy. I think that there are two reasons for using the serial killer, corporate struggles, etc., is first, a mistaken belief that you are widening the audience you can appeal to (in fact you are just making a mess) and second the supposed logic that only by having our OTP overcome a major obstacle can they truly come to love each other- which is also silly.
The best romcoms do not mix genre's. They are just comedy and romance. Need to fill out sixteen episodes? Just add side couples- it is as easy as that. Why is it so hard for writers and corporate executives to understand this?
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31 technicat
May 29, 2023 at 9:37 PM
I can't think of a lot of hard and fast rules that make my favorite rom-coms, but one thing is that they have the right casting. Some rom-coms seems to have all the the ingredients for a good bantering bickering romance except that one of the leads is a mannequin. But some actors are so good in rom coms, especially if they have great chemistry, they can power a show through its flaws (not all the time - as logicians say, it's a necessary but not sufficient condition).
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32 vienibenmio
May 30, 2023 at 3:01 PM
Imo the best rom coms have good side couples as well as the main couple
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33 Best by Test
May 30, 2023 at 5:10 PM
I like the OTP couple together, but I want them to have their own dreams and interests, which their Significant Other supports. I did not like how the FLs in both WWWSK and Her Private Life ended up "taking care" of the MLs. I wanted her to enjoy her own "art,"--not just be a good curator for other people's art, including his. And I wanted her to do something besides still being his secretary even after they got married. It doesn't need to be "professional" and make lots of money. In Do You Like Brahms, the FL gives up her violin because she isn't a child prodigy and couldn't be "top-notch" professional. She can play music! But no, she has to give it up and focus on being a great agent.
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34 zk
May 30, 2023 at 6:24 PM
i agree with so many on here that the number one thing is chemistry between the leads. i also really appreciate rom coms with strong female heroines who aren't idiots, women who are an active rather than passive participant in solving their own problems. also appreciate a rom com that doesn't rely on stupidity or a failure to communicate as a means to move the plot along. i love it when the fl has a loyal best friend, and if you can have a hilarious cast to round it out, all the better. oh, and if the male lead can have a nice voice, i'll be in heaven. :)
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zk
June 19, 2023 at 5:17 PM
i'm in the middle of i'm not a robot and i noticed that the through line for a lot of my favorite kdrama rom coms is that the male lead leads a very isolated life. may be obvious, but's not something i necessarily noticed in english speaking rom coms.
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35 cozybooks
May 30, 2023 at 10:32 PM
Lol so I'm going to be a potentially unpopular opinion and say:
I need a murder subplot in my romcoms. Or a stalker. Or something that presents an outside threat to the couple that they can bind together to fight. Here's my reasoning: a rom-com can be cute and sweet and grab my attention for the first 8-10 episodes just by being really cute and well done and allowing the leads to get to know each other (friends to lovers, enemies to lovers, roommates to lovers, strangers to lovers... whatever it is). But as soon as they're together, natural storytelling says "there has to be a new challenge, somewhere for the plot to go". At this point, I feel like the drama faces one of two choices: present some sort of internal drama or angst that the couple has to work through, or force the characters through some sort of external challenge. Either way, the eventual result is a more closely knit, bonded couple (either through working through their internal angst after breaking up/just working through it, or through supporting each other and having each other's back through the external challenge). And while Noble Idiocy can occur with serial killers and stalkers, I feel like it's far more likely to happen when the drama is internal due to family/station/I'm stopping you from achieving your dreams or what have you. I have a fairly low tolerance for noble idiocy, and I hate it when I start a drama and get hooked on how cute a couple is together only to be slapped by 2-3 episodes of angst and drawn out "but I can't be with him/her". I can do about .75 of a single episode, but if it's not resolved after that I'm likely to lose steam in the drama overall.
Anyway, I enjoy a good murder sub-plot.
Other things I like in a rom-com:
Swoony cohabitation hijinks
Sweet moments where they could go for something more physcial but opt for the forehead kiss or gesture of service instead (yeah that's a love language for me ahaha)
Wounded souls to lovers
Friends to lovers, especially if one of them is already smitten
Strangers to lovers
It's harder for me to love the "enemies to lovers", but if it's done well I'll watch it. I'm planning on giving "King the Land" a try since it seems like it's going to be pretty good :)
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cozybooks
May 30, 2023 at 10:35 PM
Also, I forgot to mention. The more ridiculous the setup is, the more likely I am to like the romcom. Tale of Nokdu, Doom at your Service, I'm not a Robot, and My Love From Another Star are some of my top Romcom picks. Same with Girl Who Sees Smells.
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HopefulRomantic 🦋 Tigermoth 🦞
May 31, 2023 at 9:51 AM
I enjoyed reading your analysis! I agree with your reasoning, and I tend to find myself preferring those external conflicts (i.e., murderer on the loose) that bring the couple closer together, rather than the internal conflicts - like refusing to explain something which leads to misunderstanding and breakups.
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Midnight
May 31, 2023 at 10:49 AM
THANK YOU for making me feel so seen and not-alone on DB! And for explaining it ten times better than me.
I have always liked some thriller elements in my romcoms. I love time-slip shows for ths same reason. I won't go so far as to say terminal illness is a favorite trope of mine, but some shows do use it as a perfect outside conflict. I also love the psychological atmosphere it creates in the story.
And I agree with you that noble idiocy still happens in such shows, but it has a completely different aura, like a dark shade hanging over it.
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cozybooks
June 5, 2023 at 8:23 PM
Always^^ I'm so glad you feel the same!
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Elinor, Team Glasses team co-captain
May 31, 2023 at 11:51 AM
Thanks for so thoroughly explaining what I've been incoherently feeling! 😅 One thing I always look for and love is that moment when our couple have to take a leap of faith and trust each other or - related - an identifiable transition from facing (or facing off against) each other to turning outward to confront some external threat or situation side by side. That's the payoff "whatever-to-lovers" moment for me. Often this is when the ML shows up to rescue the FL from embarrassment or danger by pretending to be her boyfriend, and she has to make a split-second decision to go along with it, but I also like having a thriller or at least high-stakes element instead. Queen Inhyun's Man is the perfect example of this.
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cozybooks
June 5, 2023 at 8:25 PM
Ahahahaha yes. I didn't realize it myself, but the "yup, I'm going to let this guy pretend to be my boyfriend/husband/fiance" moment also totally hits that spot for me :)
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36 Qingdao: likes scented candles
May 31, 2023 at 9:08 AM
Thanks fellow beanies! It is fascinating to see all of the opinions of my fellow-fans. I wish the writers would read all of these comments. You all express your thoughts so articulately!
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37 Nomorelisa
June 1, 2023 at 3:08 AM
The ingredients for a perfect romcom will have -
Leads that are strong-willed and have principles
No sub-plots that lengthen the series and just there as being fillers that are unnecessary
No screaming and screeching evil MiLs or antagonists
Must have character growths and the inevitable path from first meeting to passionate lovers
Real steamy kisses, not the cringe-inducing ones that make us squirm
Endings that do not just end in an embrace and a kiss or a wedding but one that shows couple's happy life after marriage
Some funny scenes with or without sound effects that makes us laugh aloud
One of the best romcom I have enjoyed very much is Something About 1% which has most of the above.
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38 Ahjummaaa
June 1, 2023 at 11:07 AM
Same, dramas that feature one night stands instantly turn me off. There's nothing romantic or funny about that.
A good rom-com starts with a well-written character that we can easily empathize and connect with. I have to believe in and be invested in the female lead in order to care about who she falls in love. For example, Yoon Eun-hye's character in Coffee Prince was someone I would have continued watching even if she didn't cross paths with Gong Yoo's character and fell in love with him. She was interesting and I was invested in her story, her outlook on life, and welfare.
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cozybooks
June 5, 2023 at 8:27 PM
I totally agree with you about being invested in the characters. That's a common thread for me throughout all media, I've realized. If I don't have someone I'm invested in (and can hopefully root for, although that's not always the case) then I'm much less likely to enjoy whatever it is.
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39 OhSoEnthusiastic
June 8, 2023 at 12:00 PM
I don't think I can contextualize an answer for what ingredients make the perfect rom-com/romance drama for me, but I can definitely look at my list of favorite romance/rom-com dramas and recognize some common denominators, so I must have some subconscious parameters, lol.
Here's some of them for anyone curious:
~We Married as a Job (Japanese)
~When the Camellia Blooms (this is romance but definitely not rom-com)
~High School King of Savvy
~The Secret of My Secretary
~A Little Thing Called First Love (Chinese)
~Weightlifting Fairy Kim Bok Joo
~Fated to Love You (Korean)
~Shopping King Louie
~Because This is My First Life
The most obvious common denominator is innocence. All of these dramas show care and appreciation and place value in innocence. I love this. There's also always one or both of the leads being romantically inexperienced/awkward (which relates back to the innocence point).
That being said, I also love the Rogue and the good girl turned the bad boy good tropes (think Han Solo and Princess Leia as an example) which isn't necessarily represented in the above list.
I guess for me it's just 'I know it when I see it.'
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jlharv
June 18, 2023 at 4:34 PM
May I just say... I love the notion that innocence is a rom com ingredient. Can you show character growth if the character is already fully matured? Not really.
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OhSoEnthusiastic
June 20, 2023 at 2:39 PM
That's a great point! I hadn't thought of that.
But I also think innocence in and of itself is a positive quality when a person is innocent in healthy and appropriate ways. I also think we all desire to be innocent in one way or another, whether we realize it or not.
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