Overall this was a really good show with some interesting ideas about parenting, intergenerational trauma, and the soul-destroying effect of social exclusion (you'll notice that both serial killers mentioned here - the Joker and the soup poisoner - ostensibly did it because they felt shunned by society). I like that Dongbaek was never shamed by the writers for her life decisions, was allowed a happy ending, and that it didn't involve her losing her son or giving up her business to support her new mother-in-law (both of which would have happened in some more traditional dramas).

I particularly liked that the conclusion of the intergenerational trauma theme (or at least the idea that our parents cede to us so many thing that influence our behaviour in so many ways) was a succession of parents realising their limitations and trying to do better. The cycle breaks first by recognising it's a cycle.

Although the show integrated a variety of genres, the relationships between mothers and their children were highlighted and that was definitely what made it so relatable. It felt like I was watching one of those family dramas with 50+ episodes, but only in 20. The best drama of the year, and one of the best of all time.

I liked this drama but I didn't connected with it like a lot of Beanies, maybe it's cultural differences but I couldn't get over how terrible bullying by ahjummas was, and it lasted for freaking 8 years, to have it resolved and forgotten so fast. The actress playing them were great and it was great setting but the bullying was too much. And honestly I think DongBaek character was weakest link, she just wasn't written very good but that on the writer because GHJ was splendid and done stellar job with what was given to her. But I'm glad it has great ratings, because it was a good drama with great cast, and let's hope it will encourage more budget for slice of life drama over flashy nonsense.

The drama was not perfect, but I can hardly remember some of it's flaws, that's how big the power of a satistying finale is. But even objectively thinking the issues the drama had were minor and it was an overall good show. The characters could at times be frustrating, but in the same way real friends can be, they seemed real and complex enough. Even really minor side characters like Jessica's mom got an arc and satisfying resolution. The drama really was good at showcasing a variety of very different women and I apreciate that. I just found out the writer also wrote Fight My Way, another good drama about ordinary people, so now I'm looking forward to their future work.

As for Joker I think they're refering to a true case. I remember someone was talking about a serial killer who wasn't active for 5 years. I don't remember which one it was. (Selective memory works sometimes.) Anyway as it was pointed out people kill for less, look at shooting cases in US. In war soldiers have to kill even if they don't want to because it's an order. The mind of a killer must work similar to a soldier's one. You're on a killing mode and nothing else matters.

But all the bullying ajummas were killing inner spirit of anyone they decided to outcast. It's a unhappy thing because people would still thinking it's normal to do it like any other form of bullying if people think they have their reasons and after some little changes it can be happily ever after. We need to start with very little kids to show them and repeat ourselves that bullying and killing isn't good because children are copying unconsciously adults unless their are reminded every day of that this kind of behaviour is very wrong.

Ah... Camellia. This show has always been special to me because it reminded me so much of the place I grew up in, minus Joker of course. Ongsan is a place full of people of all kinds, but they are all good people, just like my own little town.

Watching this show made me felt nostalgic. In that little town I grew up in, everyone knows everyone else and their entire family tree. Everyone is an aunt or an uncle to me. While watching, I often went "ooh, I can see Aunt Mary in Chan Sook, or hey, Kyu Tae is totally Uncle George". I had plenty of aunties in that neighborhood who would always tell me that I am too fat and need to loose weight or else no man would marry me. Yet, they are also the ones who would stand by me and chase away those naughty neighborhood oppas who called me fat and sang their mockery song.

Most of all, I see Deok Soon in my mom and I totally get where she's coming from, although it is extremely hard to explain. She spent her whole life protecting her sons, especially Yong Sik, and trying to remove every single stone in his path much like what my mom did for my brother. I had no doubt that Deok Soon will eventually come to her senses. She is really a sensible and good person inside and I am glad she did at the end.

This show is filled with characters that feels real to me. There are plenty of times when I thought Camellia and People with Flaws should really switch title. I am glad that the show ends with a positive note and with the message that everyone could be that little hero who work with other heroes in the neighborhood, and together their little act of kindness makes a miracle... or to be more realistic, make life just a little better.

A remarkable drama for me. Not earthshaking, but a warm, fuzzy feeling envelopes you at the end. Characters added the much needed spice to sustain each episode, although the Joker was a bit played out a lot and then was trivialized in the end. Overall, the drama made us aware of the importance of family and relationships that we may neglect along the way because of the daily grind. Much praise to the cast and the entire production group.

I saw from a comment here that the writer also wrote Fight for My Way and I totally understand why I got this warm, cozy and relaxing vibe from this show. This is not an exciting show, and the show somehow revolves around the same stories, again and again, yet it doesn't feel boring. I give the credit to the director and people involved in making this show the way it is. It is a charming show; it has its own way of telling us its story, and it managed to bring us along all the episodes without boring us.

I, however, still feel a bit off when it comes to the issue of bullying. There hasn't been anything wrong with Dongbaek from the very beginning; hence, as much as I like the fact that all people in Ongsan helped Dongbaek with her mother's condition and surgery, I think it is a bit out of place.

Having said that, one of the things I like the most in this show is the message it conveys through and through: when you love someone enough, you will protect/ try to protect that person the best you can. Apart from all the relationships between mothers and their children, we got this message from seeing how Jung Reol protected Jessica, and how Hyang-mi protected and looked after her younger brother. And I think that is what makes me like this show very much.

Thanks for the analysis everyone, I would just like to say: We want MORE PILGU!!

Apparently there are going to be 2 special episodes with extra scenes next week. But they probably won't be shown on Netflix.

In the first half of Camellia I was obsessed with this show. I would rewatch scenes and even entire episodes because I loved it do much. Eventually the episodes stopped having this effect on me and I was satisfied with one or two nice scenes. So it's not my favorite of the year because my interest eventually fizzled out, but it's still a great drama (my favorite thus far is One Spring Night, btw).

I really dislike everything involving the Joker plot. It just feels dumb to me, even so because the Joker turned out to be Heung-shik whom was the main and only suspect until his father was introduced much later in the story.

I enjoy the ending of our characters but I wish the drama had explored more the journey to get here. Everything was delayed to be resolved on the finale and it felt a little rushed. It doesn't make this a bad drama but I can't help but be disappointed that it didn't fulfill all its potential.

Still, I'll remember fondly of this little community and the bonds they share. Farewell, Ongsan.

(Some of this I already said on the fan wall, but):

The final week went unexpectedly better than I thought.
It was still quite enjoyable and a had a nice (albeit, convenient) farewell vibe to it, and I liked the final sentiment of miracles just being the total sum of luck that's owed to you.

Some issues about the second half of the show that I have a bone to pick with were offhandedly resolved, but not satisfyingly enough for me.
(1) The most annoying thing was Yong-shik's mother's disapproval of Dongbaek. She had her own (ridiculous) reasons, but her arguments were unconvincing and her persistence to maintain her position became increasingly grating and eventually unbearable.
(2) The Joker plot was rather anti-climatic towards the end, and I bet the final twist surprised no one
(3) The usual noble idiocy i.e break-up before the finale week. Although I have to say, this was one that was rather handled "well," because (imo) the show didn't indulge in the resulting pain or make it the focus for the final episodes. But still.
(4) Jong-ryeol’s ambiguous role as Pil-gu’s father. I feel like it’s such a shame that Dong-baek made Pil-gu choose between both of them, that she never properly discussed how to co-parent Pil-gu with him, which eventually robbed him of the chance of having a father (even though Yong-shik probably was a father figure).

But all in all, I liked this show in general and I'd give it an 8/10 for all the things it DID do right.
At its core, this was an exploration of human relationships; and this show portrayed it with apt intensity, compassion and grace.

I can’t wait to see what this writer does next, because I think s/he improves with each project.

I was really surprised by these last two episodes. At the end of the previous episode, the way that YS and Chief Byun were hanging their heads and apologizing for being too late, I was sure Mom had died. And the writer, and HS's dad, and HS himself had tried so hard to convince us that HS's dad was Joker (the shoes, the poison, the mutterings about witches, locking him in, and the five years since his accident), that I believed it. What a shock to find that he was covering for his son. Did it make any sense to leave his son to keep killing?

I loved this show, and the main reason I loved it was YS. He's the kind of character who could brighten anyone's day. I can't help but contrast Kang Ha-neul's comeback project with Ji Chang-wook's. KHN's will forever be on my best list, while I wouldn't even watch JCW's, which many people have nominated for worst drama ever. Sad for JCW, but so impressed with KHN. I hope he continues to do this kind of impressive work.

I'm glad that DS made up with Pil-gu and became his grandma/protector. It gives them both a reason to be happy about DB and YS's relationship. I'm also happy that JR stood up for Jessica, and that they're working on becoming a family. Even more, I'm happy that Kyu-tae and Ja-young reset their relationship. Goodbye, Ongsan, I'll miss you.

Camellia Finale ~ where do I start with you?

Positively, this was a lovely live watching experience. My mom and sister were watching, and we had conference phone calls to discuss the latest episodes, argue about spoilers, and swoon over Yong Shik (my mom does not usually swoon over actors, but her love for Kang Ha Neul now rivals my sister’s, for whom he is an ultimate bias, Can biases be genetic?). The last episode for us read like a hallmark Christmas movie, with Yuletide music, a miracle, and little boys praying for their grandma. My mom, sister, and I have a tradition of watching those cheesy movies together, so it both tickled and delighted us to no end. (My sister usually only watches horror and angsty Melos, my mom Murder mysteries, so the combination of genres in Camellia was utterly up our alley for a family watch).

The residents of Ongsan were so compelling in their completeness, we met them and saw their flaws, but as the show continued it showed us the caring, still petty, ultimately human person that each person was (except for Heung Shik, who started out a nice handyman and turned out to have no compassion underneath). The Ongsan ahjummas remind me of my mother’s matriarchal family, proud, petty, with many hurtful words, but if I was left alone with them as a child they would braid my hair and tell me that I was pretty just like my mom.

Negatively, as I understand it, the show had a four episode extension and it showed. The last few weeks I annoyed my family with my mantra of “the writer is spinning the plot wheels because they are trying to stretch out the ending” and I feel like i was proved right ~ DB had to cry and not act, not even after her elevator declaration, so that Hyang Mi’s beer glass smashed into Joker’s Head could be that epic climatic moment as I believe it had been planned since the beginning. The last lines were always meant to be her realization about life being a miracle, cheesy as that is. If we hadn’t had the plot spinning wheels before those satisfying ending moments it would have dragged on after them instead. I’m not saying that it excuses the crying (my mom sarcastically doing an impression of the director telling DB to cry more is a highlight of this watch), but it makes me understand the writer more.
I also think some of the last couple of weeks were filmed after the first half of the drama. Anyone else notice Pil Gu’s growth spurt? He had already filled out from growing a head taller, which is usually a tell tale sign of scenes added after the main shooting is done. Also the adult Pil Gu’s interview on the tv had him in different clothes than his strut down the hallway, which makes me think the cliff hanger of his annoyed call with DB was added after the interview scene, which DB and YS were always meant to be watching in their final scene.

AWWWW

this was such a warm wrap up. i loved how the show stays true to its underlying theme of ongsan, it's residents, it's family and how the ahjumma have dongbaek's back.

teared up like a baby when everyone was trying to hustle and save dongbaek's mom and praying for a miracle. and that scene at the end. "my life has been nothing but a miracle" *UGLY SOB

i enjoyed the show but couldn't find the dongbaek character fully believable - her weakness vs her moments courage & strength seemed incongruous.
also, the casting of gong hyojin seemed off too. i don't think she is objectively beautiful although she has cute & attractive characteristics. GJH doesn't have the beauty that dongbaek is portrayed to have, head turning and jaw dropping.
other than that there was some amazing acting & story telling and messages being communicated.

I was really surprised and pleased with how much I loved the conclusion of this show. I enjoyed Camellia throughout, but it was not ever going to be a "top 10" show for me. I loved the final 2 (or 4) episodes, though. They weren't perfect, but they did such a great job of wrapping up so many side plots and giving me all the warm fuzzy feelings. In a world where way too many great dramas disappoint with bad/mediocre endings, it was so nice to walk away from a show that I felt had an ending that was better than anticipated. Here's hoping for more of these in the future!

Having a preference for the quiet moments rather than the over the top Hallmark Christmas Special moments, I was especially fond of the few seconds spent showing a girl’s school uniform with Hyang-mi’s true name on it. It was a lovely way to remember her, as she wanted.

I found the Joker storyline resolution anti-climatic, but atleast they resolved it well and didn't just leave it at Heung-shik's dad. I just loved that scene of Dong-baek and the ajummas attacking him. I'm a little hazy about how they depicted the earlier scenes where they made it seem that his father was Joker, and even the DNA scenes. Must pay attention to these if I rewatch the show.
I had hoped that they would come up with a proper co-parenting arrangement, but since Pil-gu went on to play baseball, we can assume he did re-connect with Jong-ryeol over baseball and saw more of him right? I think it would have been great if it in the last scene they would have put a shot of Jong-ryeol watching him on TV too just to symbolize that.
I totally missed their daughter's uniform, yayyy for adding that detail.
I totally agree with everybody's views on this shows depiction of parenting issues as well as different kinds of women.
I think the finale could have gone a number of ways, but its really nice that they ended it on a perfect, although unrealistic note. But with the theme of miracles and the ode to ordinary people who face very similar such obstacles in life, it totally worked and really left me feeling warm and happy too! Inspite of some reservations I have, I feel totally satisfied, and yeah its true very few shows give that result.
I really enjoyed live watching it, and for the beautiful characterization and acting, this show has made it to my favourites.
I'll be looking out for more shows of the actor who played Pil-gu.

I never thought the murder mystery added to the overall story. If the Joker plot was missing, there would have been more time to explore the actual character interactions and personalities like how the market women became so powerful while their husbands became weak losers. Or why the market women kept DB at bay for so long.

I know that highly rated shows like to give sweet happy endings for fans, but the last two episodes seemed to be rushed and to miraculous. Overall it was a good drama, but it could have been better.

Thanks @selena I'm glad I watched this show. It started out rather dark and suspenseful with the discovered body of Hyangmi, but became a much warmer and healing show. I think I'll re-watch the parts where the community finally came together to help Dongbaek, when I want to get some warm feels.

I like the different takes on parenting and the parent-child relationship theme, and the reconciliation of estranged couples theme, which is kind of rare nowadays. There's hope in patience, forgiveness and second chances. 😄

It's going to be hard watching Kang Haneul as a different character after this. Kudos to KHN and Gong Hyojin for selling the romance and kudos to the whole production team for making this fun to watch and quite believable.

Aww I'm really going to miss this sweet show </3

It was fun watching it in real time, and waiting for the next episodes to air. I loved the characters and the small town vibe so much. In the middle, it dragged with the Joker subplot (I guess that's the only minor quibble I've regarding the show). Other than that, it reminded me of Pushing Daisies/Amelie with the fairy tale small quirky town vibes.

The message of kindness was beautiful and the last few episodes were AMAZING, that whatever issues I had were gone. Refreshing at times, and heartwarming as well. Definitely going to be one of those K-dramas, that people will look back on fondly 5-10 years and more down the line, and that to me is a true marker of a great K-drama. Future classic :)?

I really loved this show!

I am going to miss these characters, even though at times I was yelling at the TV. I am glad how everything turned out, especially with Pil-gu. Though I think so much could have been avoided, if just they sat down and talked with him, but we are in K-drama land. Two characters that I found charming were the lawyer and her husband - I am glad they got to work things out. The dumpling scene in the last episode brought tears to my eyes. Seems they are going have a child- cool. YS's mom came around thank goodness. I was so happy when DB's mom bought the place for her- I adored that place. Yippee. I want to live there. I knew Joker was the son- the bottle scene was cool and it was about time! Baseball dad redeemed himself and good that he and Jessica are on some road to try. I can see there is Love there. YS and DB- probably the cutest couple in K-drama land. She cried, He cried- it really worked. The one little thing that I thought was so meaningful was how the towns lady's really wanted DB to include them in her life, from the get-go, even though they gave very mixed signals, I actually understood what they meant. The scene of them all eating on the street touched my heart and I don't know what was on DB mom's head but I loved it- probably she had set her hair and it was in curlers. It showed her recovery on so many levels. Still quite shaken up about our girl that got killed.... wished it were otherwise as I found her to be very interesting and quite likeable, even with her bad choices. She died loved and an important person to at lest DB and that is something. I don't know what happened to her brother but it kinda doesn't make any sense as he seemed to adore her as a child, so the writers messed up a bit with that arc. I would have liked to have seen their daughter or at the very least a family photo on the wall of YS, DB, Pil-gu and Hwang-Go-woon. Really a cool show.

I liked this drama very much and have no major complaints at all.
I don't love the bullying, but it makes sense. It's a small, insular, Korean town where everybody has known everybody else their whole lives. Beautiful young single mom comes and opens a bar. All the men hang out there. They don't explain why to their wives. She isn't overly friendly (she does not go to the neighbourhood meetings), and from their point of view, she acts guilty when the women interact. She's not guilty, she's painfully shy and intimidated, but they don't know that- she's beautiful and her smile, as the feisty lawyer lady said, is intimidating. They feel threatened by her and nothing she does makes them feel less threatened. She hires Hyang-Mi, who is *obviously* 'no better than she should be,' (poor girl). Her son gets in fights at school and he's never the one who loses. She's the witness of a serial killer who killed her only friend in town, and who the papers say only goes after prostitutes, so their fears that she is a loose woman who could threaten their marriages are inflamed. the only women who are her friends have no husbands to worry about.

None of it is okay and it's not DB's *fault,* but it is true if she'd pushed back, if she'd asked for help with Pil-gu, if she'd gone to the neighbourhood meetings, if she'd realized what they were afraid of, that would have helped. She couldn't do those things because she was insecure. It's also true that if they had gone to her bar, if they had tried to be friendlier and ask some questions and find out more about her that would have helped. They couldn't do that because they felt insecure about her. The bullying and ostracizing was wrong. But it wasn't not only because she's not one of them. It's based in totally misunderstanding each other. It only starts to get better when they realize they were wrong about her.
I don't blame DS, either. I am an American and so my culture's understanding of family ties is much looser and more inclusive than a Korean Ajumma of DS's age, and I still wouldn't have wanted my kids to fall in love with a guy with a kid. That's so much harder adn more complicated than the life I want for them. I wouldn't have pitched a fit like DS, but that's because as an American, I have much less say in who my kids marry anyway. She was always going to come around, I think even she knew it.

I loved the 'It's a Wonderful Life" style Christmas ending, too. Cheesy, unrealistic, only in drama-land, but still heartwarming and sweet and celebratory of the theme- that normal people matter, normal, every day people in any neighbourhood can be and are heroes.

Finally finished the drama. Unfortunately i really didnt connected to the dramas like you guys. Only thing interesting was to me was Kim Ji Suk- the son relationship. How it would be much better given he didnt know he had a son. I blame Dongbaek a lil bit for this.
I actually watched Camellia Blooms, flower crew: joseon marriage agency and Tale of Nokdu. But disappointed by each one. Then I tried A little thing called first love. I am in love with this drama. Never seen such good chinese drama for a while now.

It took me almost a week to finally find the time when I won’t be interrupted while watching the finale. I love the whole drama so much that I want to enjoy my last moments with all the characters thoroughly.
Aside from thinking that this show would be better at 16 episodes, I love everything else. If the killer is indeed the father instead of Heung Shik, that would be fine as well. I just thought that the twist of making Heung Shik the killer was just another plot to drag the story (or maybe it was Heung Shik all along and they make the dad the killer to drag the story. Who knows. 🤷🏼‍♀️)
Aside from that, I love everything else. Kang Ha Neul and Gong Hyo Jin are such a good actors. They even cried beautifully. Everyone else has their closure. Love the Ongsan community, love Pil Gu and his future, even Jong Ryeol and Jessica.

Thank you When Camellia Blooms for the past 3 months. You’re definitely gonna get a bulk of my beans from this year beanies count! 😍😋

Beanies, there are still a find spots that I do not quite understand...

1. Why did HS still put out cat food?
2. Why did HS still sent DB's mom to hospital when he knew that she had seen him at the scene? Red herring??
3. Why did HS lock his dad inside the house?

Hope you can share your thoughts.

This is interesting -- https://www.soompi.com/article/1368466wpp/kim-kang-hoon-picks-between-kang-ha-neul-and-kim-ji-suk-gives-jun-hyun-moo-relationship-advice Here, the actor who plays Pil-gu says that in reality he would pick Kim Ji Suk over Kang Ha Neul for Pil-gu's father because Kim Ji Suk played with him and took care of him like a real father on the set of When the Camellia Blooms. Always a fan of Kim Ji Suk, I was happy to read that.

So what really happened to Hyang Mi? What about the plankton in her liver? And her not being dead before getting thrown in the lake? Did she purposefully eat the ear thing Heung Sik owns?