great powers of observation.
thanks for continuing to stimulate dialogue.

I'm glad that sex is being more open in these dramas! though I personally could care less for Sex in the City type shows (SITC made me gag, not for the sex or the plot, but for the women in the show). What I do like is how Coffee Prince is changing things up a bit.

What drew me to Coffee Prince is it shows that love has no gender, which is what I also like about the Japanese and Taiwanese dramas, Hana Kimi- You simply fall in love with the person you are most attracted to on a physical and emotional level. HG fell in love with EC even he thought she was a boy, it truly shows that love has no bounds.

I also love how it touched on women being more independent (such as EC being the head of her family, or wanting to wait to get married until she has settled with her life and is making a general income so she doesn't have to live off of HG). What got me the most though was, though EC is more conservative and thinks you don't have sex until after marriage, even she is human and understands that you can be with the person you love married or not.

Great post!

-Jamie

kdramas do generally tend to hold back a lot about sex but the movies are far more open about it. The same actors who appear passionate in movies hold back in dramas. I don't know why that is, but that's just the way it appears.

Actually, I know why that is... I'm sure there's censorship in Korean T.V. just like there is in American T.V.

But as an American (well, kinda) viewer, it is quite frustrating to watch a supposedly passionate couple kiss like they are 5 year olds... or cold fish.

It is nice to see Han Gul and Yu Ju because for starters, they are both in their thirties and for years, had no plans to get married so it would make no sense to not have sex. What would they be waiting for?

Other dramas have pre-marital sex (Queen of the Game but they end up with a baby), Dal Ja's Spring and Kim Sam Soon (although they made it comedic), Lovers etc etc so pre-marital sex in dramas still not unchartered waters.

Sarah, this is a very interesting post. I'd never heard of/watched the shows you described, but in my time with K-drama I've noticed mainstream shows becoming bolder regarding the physical side of love. Coming from a culture that is "hypocritically" (I guess that might/might not be too strong a word) conservative in its silver screen too, I can completely understand what you mean that its not all representative of the actual population. Just because it takes 6-7 episodes for our leads to peck each other's cheeks leads to the presumption that in Korea (or India) you'd never see a couple kiss! Which is, ofcourse, a complete misconception, and there are instances when people get a true cultural shock because they don't find the naive nation they expected. On the other hand, with the American screen already open about sexuality with shows like SATC, or Will & Grace, Girlfriends, etc., there's a LARGE idea that most Americans are sex-crazed and continually making out in the streets. HA. Its actually what a lot of new students from conservative countries expect to find here. I think thats a very fascinating aspect of culture and media...how it gets broadcasted in a movie or a show can completely change the perception of the world.
Back to Korea, I think with shows like CP, k-drama PDs are testing the waters and realizing that the culture's ready for a more candid view of sex and love too. I'm not sure if it created any kind of controversy in Korea (did it?). When I started watching, the climax and end of the show was often a kiss. Now, as shows get more realistic, and relationships are better developed like in MNIKSS, "skinship ;)" is more present and nicely done.
With Bollywood in the past few years (if you're interested!), there's been a kind of frantic craze to catch up to the Western world, in trying to talk about sex and fitting it in awkwardly and often vulgarly. Sex and conversations about sex are still depicted very crudely or unnaturally in a large part of Indian cinema (and not at all in the starkly conservative Indian dramas), which really disappoints me. Passion and emotion can be portrayed more gracefully, like done in CP perhaps. And it can be discussed with more wit and realism, like SATC, or, based on what you described, Romance Hunters. Regardless of those opinions, there's atleast a similar effort to shake off the false cloak of "we don't touch fingers until marriage" kind of idea that the world has. I think thats healthy and important, to realize that people everywhere, in cultures like ours, are all aware of the physical aspect of love and maintain a healthy, natural sexuality.
Thanks for that insight, Sarah!

funny thing is, this morning I was also wondering how sex was perceived in the korean culture ... because dramas never seem to explore that side of relationships...its all about the emotional part, but i just gotta wonder if those people (characters) aren't sexualy frustrasted with all the talking...I mean in "Exhibitions of fireworks" the character played by Han chae Young was with her boyfriend for almost a decade and they had never, ever ...ever... e.v.e.r...had sex...I mean I don't know a man that would go 2 months without ...but then again people do say "you can't miss something you've never had," but i doubt that goes for anybody over the age of 17-especially for boys-... Its good to see that there are dramas such as Coffee Prince, that are not afraid of talking about sex, though it they don't take it lightly...But i do admire that side of Korean culture... Not the fact that the media is trying to portray an asexual kind of a society, but the fact that sex is not something they take lightly... thanks for sharing this J-Beans

I thought Koreans were probably puritanical about sex until I saw Kim Sung Soo's debut movie about love and sex (I forget the name). :O I nearly had a heart attack with its extraordinarily frank portrayal of sex...

In the time it took for me to post my comment, it became moot lol

I have often wondered if kdramas are reflective of society or if they are didactic...attempting to "teach" viewers how to behave (I hope that doesn't sound too strong)...they seem to be family-centric at least in terms of marital conditions/parental approval for marriage...they also seem to emphasize self-sacrifice (most often, it seems, for the sake of family)

Perhaps they are trying to get the largest audience possible? Because my mom and her friends (all in the mid-50s) won't watch shows that are heavy on the sex and intimate relationships. It's one of the main reasons none of them watch American TV and movies and stick to Asian ones.

And while the younger audience might not be offended, they aren't turned off when sex isn't portrayed.

So by being more conservative, the show can attract a larger "family" audience.

Romance Hunter and Hyena both sound interesting. I can't find a Wiki page for Romance Hunter, so maybe it's not subbed by fans? I hope it's also available on Clubbox

"Rather than Korean society being puritanical, I just assumed that it was due to a deeply developed sense of social courtesy/sensibility to not talk about sex;especially in polite company. And, that sense governs the extent of discussing any sexual issues in the dramas because the drama has to be polite and courteous to the viewer. Discussing sex would be tantamount to talking about your athlete’s foot at the dinner table. I’m not so familiar with Korean society, but I’m pretty sure that it’s true for Chinese society."

Auntie Mame makes a good point. I think in a way its trying to be more polite and not talk about it too much about in public. Im thinking these dramas are made by those, maybe coz they want help people open up and introduce a more open view and test waters. Its a topic for them to be kept more private? I also like the fact that in Kculture, sez isnt taken that lightly and for it to be shown in a different aspect makes it different from other cultures. But i think audiences are becoming more mature about it, i can also name 'What's Up Fox' as one of those risque dramas, after the steamy scene from Lovers as well. But I agree with Sarah, that like dramas like Samsoon and Dalja it was handled well. That's better to see I think.

I never really saw it that way, but i did wonder why in some dramas the "LOVE "scenes were a bit dull, or conservative!!! but after cp, when i see han gyul, and eun chan do what they do, im more like WOW!!! and that is kinda cool to see after so many dramas that leave me with a "That's it?"!!! so im exicited to see change, and maybe that's why im more addicted to cp because it eases my curiousity!!!...
You know how to hit a good topic...that's why im never bored!! Thank you!!! Keep blogging!

#15 "Gail -- gramps, is that you?"

Hindi nga!. The timestamps give a clue that lolo and I are several zones apart. When lolo last posted it was around 2.00 am UK time. I'm actually the wrong side of that apparently crucial "mid-50s" age-band where, according to one other comment here, people have forgotten all about sex and don't want to be reminded about it in their TV viewing, so by that hour I am safely in bed and presumably asleep. What else is there for relics like me to do there?

I had never thought Koreans were puritanical about sex regardless of how they were portrayed in the dramas because life just ain't like that in modern society. So when i watched unmoving kisses (as it it was put on pause mode!) while the camera pans 360 deg (lovers in Paris LOL, eventhough I love Park Shin Yang) and almost very few scenes that indicated the couple ever consumated their relationship.... I said, hey, this just ain't real, whoever kisses like that and when a couple love each other so much, how can they go with many YEARS without a sexual relationship - so I just take it as they do but the dramas just doesn't show it - and with that my heart and mind can accept it and move on!

KUDOS to "LOVERS" drama for being one of the leaders to show a lonnnnnnngggggggggggg passionate kiss that ended in bed.....and now Coffee Prince..... to me these scenes makes the dramas more realistic and natural......AJA

#14 Marzy "talking about your athlete’s foot at the dinner table"

Maybe that would be quite an innocent topic in Korea. One of the nice things about the shift to HDTV is you get to read all the shopfronts in the background (or you do if like me you're a text maniac). And lo and behold, it turns out that in Seoul there are branches of a sportshoe chain called, in all linguistic innocence, "Athlete's Foot". I thought those little shopsign gems were confined to France, where they are a constant source of amusement to Anglophones.

Hey! Great comments as usual and the speed of your posts continues to amaze me. Total non sequiter but didja hear that they're making a Hana Yori Dango movie to air sometime in summer 2008? Everyone from the original cast is coming back and from what little they've said, it seems like they might be following the Paris/Shizuka's wedding storyline that ended the manga not that long ago...

sorry to disagree with the rest...but what about those who're just not into pre-marital sex whatever the case is...those who still fear God and believe that He actually exists...I'm glad when many kdramas actually respect this group of people.

I actually love how asian dramas are more conservative and innocent when it comes to the love relationship between a man and a woman. Seriously, I've seen enough of those American shows where they would make out and jump on the bed in almost all scenes/episodes whatever. That's why I like watching asian dramas more, it's not extreme like the media over here.

sorry no offense, but about pre-marital sex by the name of the temporary emotion/feeling so-called "love", do you seriously think it's lovely, honourable and pleasing to the conscience?

I understand the viewpoints of all the commentators. Is the lack of showing any sexual/physical aspects of a relationship because of 1) censorship, 2) respect for the audience, 3) desire to teach the audience a lesson, or whatever else. But how are we to really believe that a couple is madly in love when all they do is kiss, and for the most part, kiss really badly too?! I mean, of most of the kdramas that I have see, the girlfriend and boyfriend often kiss like they hate each other (just a peck on the lips, really stiff, no movement of the mouth, lips, tongue, etc.). If kdramas really want to portray the realness of any relationships, they need to show that a pair of madly in love couple doesn't just give each other just a peck on the lips. And that it sometimes involves sex!